Endurance.Net Ridecamp Archives

Hi, Lauren.

As a result, I also got a whole bunch of Matt-stories in private  
mail.  I responded to your initial post because you started the it  
with a question:
>>Does anyone have any suggestions on what to do when a ride manager  
says that they will refund your entry fee's but then never does and  
doesn't return calls?<<

But you weren't looking for suggestions!   I felt it was just  
disingenuous to ask for suggestions as if it was going to be private  
whom the individual offender was, and then in the same post bring up  
his name. Had you already gotten information from the NorCal types  
about his business practices before making your post?

I wrote because of your statement:
>>What do we do? I'm out $95. and that is easy to absorb but I sure  
feel sorry for Cindy. That's a lot of money. This incident sure makes  
me never to want to pre-pay again.<<

That sort of statement, put out to all ride managers and riders out  
there, implies that pre-paying is a Bad Thing. Yeah.  It can be.  I  
once withdrew from a ride three weeks ahead of time, due to a horse  
injury subsequent to a multi-day, and they withheld $20 as an admin  
fee.  Three weeks is a long time.  That bugged me.  Another ride, a  
multi-day, I only did two of the days and never got the other two  
days' worth--though I expected only a partial refund or even credit  
on another event.  Water under the bridge, but I would treat those  
managers differently and probably pay the $10 late fee rather than  
pre-register.  I always read the refund policy.

I did NOT defend Matt's actions in any way.  I asked if there were  
extenuating circumstances, which now that I've heard all this in  
private about his family's business practices, it seems as if there  
were none.  AERC does need a way to deal with this sort of behavior,  
with a sh!t list like AHA runs in their monthly magazine--in the  
meantime, I guess all we have is voting with our feet, the ancient  
practice of shunning.

You did not respond to the irony of no refund to him from the Santa  
Fe ride.  He was pretty strident about that.  Karma?

Out of region folks have to be super-careful, yep.  Even asking on  
the list about a ride you're interested in attending would probaby  
have elicited a whole bunch of advice in this case, don't you think?

Lynne

http://www.photo.lynnesite.com



On Feb 12, 2008, at 3:37 PM, Lauren Horn wrote:

> Lynne,
>
> I could have asked this question and not named the individual but I  
> specifically choose to mention Matt by name for a reason. I put a  
> lot of thought into this "public" outing and I'm not one to do this  
> sort of thing, but based on the facts I think bringing it to the  
> public may be the only way to solve this. Matt has had numerous  
> opportunities to respond, not only to me, but to other people by  
> phone or email. The issue is NOT if the refunds were valid as Matt  
> told both Cindy and I that refund checks would be issued. The issue  
> is  non payment after being told he would mail the checks and non  
> response to any attempts to reach Matt.
>
> This is not "trial by RideCamp", but a genuine, calm discussion  
> about how to proceed and also to see if others did not get promised  
> refunds. Looks like there is more of us out there. Lynne, your the  
> only "negative" responder to my email but I've gotten numerous  
> private emails with Matt stories. Being a past ride manager I'm  
> sure you are sensitive to these issues but learning what I now  
> know, I wouldn't be so fast to jump on the wagon and support Matt.
>
> I agree with you that pre paying does help out hard working ride  
> managers that may need some up front seed money. What I wish I had  
> known is that Matt had the reputation of not paying entries and  
> other money issues and the many people who knew his reputation paid  
> at the ride instead of mailing in the money. It's us trusting folks  
> from another region, who had no knowledge of his reputation that  
> sent in the money.
>
> There is this one ride manager from NATRC who never refunded a  
> friends entry. For two years she was promised a check. She finally  
> had to go to the president of NATRC and put pressure, but why  
> should she have to do that? So now, I don't up front pay when I  
> enter that managers ride. I'm glad I know what I know and I just  
> play it safe.  With Matt, it would have been nice to know too. Five  
> Hundred dollars nicer for Cindy. That's a lot of nice.
>
> Lauren
>
>
>
> On Feb 12, 2008, at 9:10 AM, Lynne Glazer wrote:
>
> > Here we go, trial by ridecamp.  This sort of thing sickens me.   
> > Lauren, you could have asked this question without bringing up the  
> > individual, couldn't you?
> >
> > "this incident sure makes me never want to pre-pay again".  You  
> > have the option on most rides to pay a late fee in order to enter  
> > at the last minute, don't you?
> >
> > Pre-payment is requested by well-meaning, hard working, ride  
> > managers who can't necessarily afford to front the up-front costs  
> > of a ride like awards and porta-johns, meals for volunteers and  
> > vets, etc.
> >
> > It is interesting to me if it is true about this person as he was  
> > one of the folks who didn't get a refund from the for withdrawing  
> > months ahead of Great Santa Fe ride and was most vociferous about  
> > the organizer's behavior.
> >
> > Was this Medeiros ride's refund policy in writing?  Were there  
> > extenuating circumstances?  Ride management is certainly not for  
> > the faint of heart, remembering the year when we had 44  
> > withdrawals in the week before a ride, due to weather.  Of course  
> > the funds had already been laid out for lots of stuff, and of  
> > course the manhours expended for ride packets, etc..  I hadn't  
> > cashed any of the checks, but it was no less a loss just because  
> > of the convenience of being able to rip them up.
> >
> > Lynne
> > http://www.photo.lynnesite.com
> >
> >
> >
> > On Feb 12, 2008, at 7:52 AM, Lauren Horn wrote:
> >
> > > Does anyone have any suggestions on what to do when a ride  
> > > manager says that they will refund your entry fee's but then  
> > > never does and doesn't return calls?
> > >
> > > Matt Medeiros and his wife put on the StageCoach Ride (W) last  
> > > November  and strongly encouraged paid pre entries. I pre paid  
> > > for two days but only ended up riding one day. Cindy Crook on the  
> > > other hand paid for 2 people for 3 days and is out over $500. She  
> > > called and told Matt she couldn't make it. He assured her too  
> > > that he would send a refund check. Matt has originally told us  
> > > both that he would send the money but has never and ignores our  
> > > calls and emails. I wonder who else he owes money too?
> > >
> > > What do we do? I'm out $95. and that is easy to absorb but I sure  
> > > feel sorry for Cindy. That's a lot of money. This incident sure  
> > > makes me never to want to pre-pay again.
> > >
> > > Lauren


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