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Re: [RC] SADDLE "FIT" DATABASE strategy, for the record. - Robert Ferrand

Mike,
 
Your point is well taken, however, I would like to point out your comment "the Garbage In - Garbage Out data model I routinely have to fix for my clients". makes my point: that at the beginning of this research we need to allow equestrians, "free-form text" to express their understanding, and it can be fixed later. (which is your stock and trade ) If we lock them into a "matrix" which can be easily queried, we are prejudicing the results from the beginning. If you have a better idea for a design, I am all ears, however, please understand what I am trying to do.
 
From my research so far, I see the equestrian universe as a multitude of galaxies within which are a multitude of solar systems, each revolving around a trainer, a breed, a philosophy, or whatever, the challenge is: each of the solar systems really do not communicate very well to each other. Case in point, Dressage riders have little discussion with team penners. Some endurance riders may do hunt seat, but it is not common. Therefore, in building this database, we are trying to see if there is any commonality, in how different equestrian groups approach saddle fit and whether they have any real understanding of the physiology and physics of saddle fit. This is not an easy task with some many different views.
 
Now, that said: once we have a broader understanding of what the equestrians universe is actually believing about saddle fit, then we can focus on building a more easily queried database to address specific issues. From the responses that we have already received, I do not see any reason to restrict the data so early in the process. Employing a "free form text" allows people to speak their mind, which yields some interesting insight. As a database designer, you must appreciate that once the data is acquired, it can be rearranged. First things first, let's acquire the data, without prejudice.
 
You never know what develops, once you begin to measure. What you may think is happening is not, but something else develops. When I began measuring the interface pressures under saddles, ten years ago, I had no idea that the vast majority of saddles "bridged". I would have thought out of random selection a higher percentage would have fit. It did not make any sense to me, at the time. Even when we developed the gauge to measure the angles and arcs to describe the polyform shape of the horses back and corresponding saddle, (so the data could be put into a database and queried)  I did not appreciate the profound effect that the rider's weight had on the horse's back. Even as recently as two years ago, now that we have begun to measure the shape of the horse's scapulae and build structures to accommodate that shape, we are discovering the horse's moving differently. You can not improve that which you do not measure.
 
So my point is, with due respect to all the database managers out there, I do understand how to measure and at this point I prefer to continue to allow equestrians to input their thoughts through "free-form" text, even if I am building a database managers nightmare. Look on the bright side, this could provide you a large "data model you routinely have to fix", but who knows what will actually come out of this research. I am already amazed as some of the input and it has not even been up a week. So I will keep an open mind and will appreciate any suggestions you may have to improve this data collection.
 
Robert Ferrand
Saddle Researcher
----- Original Message -----
From: Mike Sofen
Sent: Saturday, December 27, 2003 8:25 AM
Subject: RE: SADDLE "FIT" DATABASE strategy, for the record.

>>
From: Robert Ferrand [
mailto:sadddle@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
Your point that the entry form is improperly designed to provide statistically relevant data because all fields are "free-form entry" is not correct. Currently, we are making a WIDE sweep of the ENTIRE EQUESTRIAN COMMUNITY - WORLD WIDE to better understand what the equestrian community, which comprises 80+ breeds of horses, and as many cross breeds, in a multitude different disciplines, with an undefined number of different types of saddles, so that we all can better understand what equestrians actually believe about saddle fit. You are quite correct, this increases the complexity of querying the database, (hence Oracle), however, I think this is a better approach AT THE BEGINNING OF THE RESEARCH, to let the equestrian community define the parameters, not the saint at the computer. To my knowledge, NO company, institution, or individual has ever attempted an effort on this scale. As the data comes in, we can easily alter the parameters accordingly. So bring them on.<<


Unfortunately, your expertise and passion is in the field of saddle fit measurement, not database design, and that was the whole point of my response.  You chose instead to mount a soapbox and try to convince us that not only are you altruistic but that there is no linkage between your "research" and your business, and that your research design was correct.
 
I have a different opinion.  I can clearly see such a linkage, AND that isn't why I'm responding now.  I'm responding, once again, to your belief that your research design is appropriate.  With 15+ years as a database architect working for the largest of companies, I can tell you flat out, without hesitation it isn't...you will store data that CANNOT be queried for VALID statistical measures.  You have created the classic "Garbage In - Garbage Out" data model that I routinely have had to fix for my clients.
 
Mike Sofen
Santa Cruz, CA

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RE: [RC] SADDLE "FIT" DATABASE strategy, for the record., Mike Sofen