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Lori, I think you point out exactly the problem many of us are dealing 
with!  I'm only just realizing that the Certified Journeyman Farrier 
I've used for years just doesn't see hoof imbalances.  He's now learning 
to trim barefoot & learning from good sources but, alas, from a 
distance.  He's reading books and watching videos but neither will help 
him relearn to look at the hoof he's working on.  When I pulled my 
horse's shoes and we had/have a long, painful and frustrating 
transition, I took it upon my self to learn about hooves.  I know very 
little but I'm at least learning to really look.  However, if I had 
stayed with that person, I don't know that I could have ever persuaded 
him to *see* my horse's long toe/under run heel, and medial/lateral 
imbalances.  I'm counting my lucky stars that I've found someone else 
recently who I'm hoping will have better trained eyes!

As for what we can do when we're stuck with a "know it all?"  I guess 
the options range from learning to trim/shoe our own horses to learning 
how to engage the farrier/trimmer in making the hooves look the way *we* 
think they should.  That probably means going back to psych 101 and 
figuring out what makes the guy/woman tick.  Most of us are women and 
most of us deal in our non-horsey lives with people who believe and 
think differently than we do.  Most of us are pretty good at figuring 
out how to deal with these people so we can at least work the same deal 
with our farriers/trimmers: flirt, bring out a nice, cool iced tea (or 
beer!), appear neat and wear clean jeans so we appear both 
"professional" and willing to honor his/her professional status; 
remember not to rant and rail; ask questions (based on what we want the 
hooves to look like) but don't throw our knowledge in his/her face, 
etc., etc., etc.
Laney

Lori Bertolucci wrote:
> Lynne, good article.
> There is only one thing I have to ask...not for me, but for others with 
> "know it all" farriers/horseshoers...how do you go about getting them to 
> correct their mistakes? 
> I went thru a number of horseshoers, knowing things weren't correct with 
> our horses feet. None were willing to listen to me, and continued as 
> they wanted.
> I started taking care of my endurance horse, but the rest had to suffer. 
> Luckily, I now have a farrier that not only works with me, but is also 
> very much into teaching me things I didn't know and learning more about 
> the bare foot.(not looking for a shod or unshod debate here folks  :)  )
> Some people just don't have the opportunity to shop around for a good 
> farrier, and have to make do.
> What can they do?
>  
> Lori
>
> */Lynne Glazer <lynne@xxxxxxxxxx>/* wrote:
>
>     My friend and shooting partner Cristy Cumberwork wrote this post on
>     the fuglyhorseoftheday blog today, and I feel this concise info is
>     worth sharing, am sure the content is old news to many of you.
>     Cristy's been riding competitive trail since she was a kid along with
>     her family, they manage rides, and she did take the horse mentioned
>     below to Tevis though before his feet issue had been identified much
>     less resolved. She's the editor of Hoof Print, the NATRC pub. (I'm
>     oversensitive about proper trimming/shoeing anyway, but my own
>     horse's ideally shod feet were nearly ruined while recently on trial
>     for sale, wearing shoes that had only been on for two weeks but that
>     shoer had done everything wrong--it's going to take 3 shoeing cycles
>     to fully restore his fronts, one down, two to go, though he is
>     rideable.)
>
>     ---
>     For those that are having a hard time with evasiveness while ridden.
>     (Popping shoulders, not wanting to round) You can make sure the horse
>     is physically ABLE to do it first by taking a good long look at their
>     feet. So much bad and undesirable behavior comes from unbalanced
>     feet. Especially long toes and underrun heels and medial-lateral
>     imbalances too. Most of us just love our farriers and assume they are
>     doing the best job....... but how do you really know?
>
>     Here's a few clues to look for. Get down at the foot level and look,
>     REALLY look, at the coronet bands from the front. Are they level? If
>     they are tilted then the medial/lateral balance is off and can cause
>     pain (and eventually remodel the bones too, but doesn't take as long
>     as you might think). Are there flares? Usually the pain from medial/
>     lateral balances are not enough for the horse to show unsound (at
>     first anyway), but still.... ouch, think of the canters, gallops and
>     landing a jump!. Are there any humps or curves in the top of the
>     coronet band? If there is, that is a place where there is pressure
>     pushing the coronet band up.... a spot where the hoof wall needs a
>     wee bit extra trimming or rasping to allow that section of hoof to
>     "drop". Sometimes you can have the foot "leveled" and wait overnight
>     and some of it will drop, telling you exactly where the pressure is
>     and allowing it to be rasped again before shoes are applied.
>     Sometimes all you need is 20 minutes for it to drop.
>
>     When you look at your horse from the side, is there any hoof under
>     the cannon bone? If not, the hoof has migrated forward. (this
>     appearance can also be caused by long slopey pasterns, in both cases
>     the horse needs trailers on his shoe to help give support under the
>     cannon bone) Also look for a smooth unbroken line from the pastern
>     joint through the hoof. if that angle is 'broken' the hoof is likely
>     out of balance. The angle of the shoulder, pastern hoof and head
>     should all just about match. I see lots and lots of 'broken back'
>     angles on horses, meaning the angle of the hoof is less than the
>     angle of the pastern and is usually accompanied (and caused by) long
>     toes, underrun heels. (X-rays will tell the truth but it's often very
>     apparent by just looking. This condition put major EXTRA forces on
>     the suspensory and other tendons and ligaments and will often cause
>     suspensory soreness that no one can quite figure out how to make go
>     away. It also puts TONS of pressure on the P2 (short pastern) P3
>     (coffin bone) joint and guess what is right under that joint.... you
>     guessed it.... the navicular bone!!!!! It can actually be squished up
>     against the joint and become misshapen by the pressure on it. Many
>     many cases of "navicular" (I use that term lightly 'cause many people
>     call the many things that CAN go wrong there by one name, including
>     vets). Just so long as you know 'navicular' can be any number of
>     things happening in that particular area. Hopefully that will be
>     enough info to help you talk to your farrier (and vet) about the
>     condition of your horses feet a little. All of the above issues can
>     be corrected or helped with REAL balanced trimming, more can be
>     corrected with therapeutic shoeing except conformation but some of
>     that can be even be fixed if caught when the horse is under a year old.
>
>     Horses are really pretty damn stoic, by design, and often there are
>     little things about the feet that cause pain that they don't tell you
>     about in an obvious way. They often opt for what we refer to as
>     behavioral problems, many of which are little (or big) evasions. If
>     you horses feet are properly balanced according to its individual
>     conformation, it's amazing how many of these evasive behavioral
>     issues will just fizzle away. You may not know it but if your
>     horse's hooves are not balanced, they are probably slowly
>     degenerating. Hoof imbalances can impair circulation to the hoof
>     which, in turn, can cause bone and tissue degeneration, which can
>     cause more circulation issues....vicious cycle. Eventually the horse
>     can't help but show the pain and sometimes by the time he "tells"
>     you, it's too late. He gets retired.
>
>     Not all farriers are created equal! Not all vets are either. (I have
>     met plenty that are clueless as to the P1, P2, P3 alignment as well
>     as lateral/medial imbalances, all of which can mold the bones and
>     misshape them and it doesn't take as long as you think.) How do I
>     know all this? The hard way. But with therapeutic shoeing, he is
>     doing much, much better and it much happier and is moving better than
>     he ever has. He will hopefully be balanced enough able to go barefoot
>     again. (One proper trim is not gonna fix it. It takes time because
>     the foot takes about one year to grow one full cycle.) Lo and
>     behold, the horse that was given to me with the only half-joking
>     nickname of Widowmaker is pretty happy these days.... and guess what,
>     after 17 years of walking around like a banana shape (upside down,
>     from ears to tail) the horse now rounds himself when he works. (But
>     don't fret--he's still capable of calling out Mr. Hyde :-) but he has
>     fewer reasons to do so.) Once we balanced the feet, THEN we worked
>     on the training part. Lots of bending exercises and longeing (with
>     side reins placed as close to the withers as possible, NOT down by
>     the girth) to get him to step under and quit evading straightness,
>     and even lots of riding time cutting across hills to keep the weak
>     side uphill to force it to work. He's 23 and remolding the muscles
>     is slow but progressive. The important thing is now he physically CAN.
>
>     Some cool references: Horseshoeing by Anton Lungwitz, translated by
>     John Adams (a book). The Principles of Horseshoeing, 2nd or 3rd
>     edition by Dr. Doug Butler (another book) Equinestudies.org (Dr. Deb
>     Bennett, how to achieve straightness, see article "Lessons from
>     Woody" at the minimum). SustainableDressage.com (really really nice
>     section on tack as well as true vs. false collection).
>
>     I hope that help some of you and your horses out. Proper balance in
>     the feet (based on the individual horses conformation, you must trim
>     the WHOLE HORSE) does not matter if it's shod or barefoot. THAT is
>     the core, whether you put shoes on or not after the balancing has
>     been done properly, fine. There is soooooo much more to the story
>     but that is a decent starting point I hope. No Hoof, No Horse.
>
>     Post Script: Even since taking my horse through the process of
>     rebalancing his long out-of-balance feet, I have become intensely
>     interested in hooves. I have since gotten all my mom's horses' feet
>     balanced and we have a lot of much more comfortable happier horses
>     now--and the young ones, well they aren't getting the chance to
>     become imbalanced. They are much more fun to ride and teach things
>     to! I continue to work with my vet AND farrier on other clients'
>     horses documenting the progress they are making. Many, many of the
>     clients report back that the horses are more willing and feel like
>     they are moving more free and easy especially once their long toes
>     are disposed of. My job is to watch horses, I am a pro equine
>     photographer and I go to many many events. I can't help but look at
>     feet now too, it's like an obsession and there are lots and lots of
>     horses out there with problems. Hopefully this will inspire you, the
>     horse owner, to take a good long look at your horses feet and ask
>     questions of your farrier AND vet and take the time to educate
>     yourself so you can make a good informed choices on who helps you
>     care for your horse and give it longevity as well as many many
>     comfortable days doing its job.
>
>
>
>
>
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