Re: Strongid C

["Karen Steenhof" <steenhof@cyberhighway.net>]

Hi Tracy-
I have one of the horses who did not do well on Strongid C--I have posted my
1994 experience with anemia many times on ridecamp over the  years.  The
anemia cleared up as soon as I took him off Strongid C.  This same horse
also had a serious anterior enteritis in 1993.  It was not until this year
that I learned (via ridecamp) that the colic also may have been related to
Strongid.  He had been on Strongid for a few years prior to the colic, and I
had pulled him off of it 10 days or so before an FEI ride to be sure we were
in compliance with the drug rules.  So I don't know if it was the Strongid
or the cold turkey from it (or something else).  Anyway the horse has been
doing fine on 6-8 week paste wormers for the last 4 years (6325 miles,17
years old)

I found some old posts from Heidi that might be more credible than my
"1-rat" anecdotal report.  Read on, if you are interested....

Karen Steenhof
Boise, Idaho
steenhof@cyberhighway.net

****************************************************************************
From Heidi:

Roger, I'm glad you have luck with Strongid C.  Certainly not all endurance
horses on it get sick.  However,  of the over a million horses on the stuff,
only a few thousand are endurance horses.  I have seen NO problems in non-
endurance horses, nor have I heard of any in talking personally to hundreds
of
other veterinarians.  However, if one counts the horses I have personally
encountered as well as those observed by other veterinarians with whom I
have
personally conversed or corresponded, one can count up somewhere in the
neighborhood of 30 to 50 horses that have had either anterior enteritis or
anemia shortly after starting on the product, and have improved to normal
levels (CBC's and performance) when the product has been withdrawn.  This
does
not constitute any sort of scientific proof, but if most companies saw a
reaction rate of 30 to 50 per two or three thousand in any other drug in a
particular class of horses,  there would be warning labels plastered all
over
it.  We have an adverse reaction rate in something like 5 per 1000 to E-Se
and
Schering plasters warning labels all over the bottle!  I'm sure my numbers
for
Strongid C usage are not precise as no one has queried how many endurance
horses are on it, but I ask riders in my area if they use it, and very few
ever did, so I have a gut feeling that my numbers err toward the generous as
to how many even use the stuff.  Obviously, in your case, the risk of worm
load seems to outweigh the risk of using the product, and isn't that the
incentive to use ANY product?

Heidi




I don't know that I have elaborated on ridecamp as to my thoughts as to why
Strongid C may affect endurance horses, although I have individually to some
of you who have asked.  It has been generally noted among many people who
recommend Strongid C that even horses without parasites tend to "bloom" when
on the product and gain weight.  As the product is not significantly
absorbed
by the horse, I am led to hypothesize that this effect is due to some change
within the GI tract itself, perhaps due to some change in the gut flora.  I
would suspect that if this is true, perhaps this change is deleterious to
how
at least some endurance horses digest feed.  One could possibly also explain
the anemias this way, too, since the bacteria in the gut manufacture many of
the vitamins that the horse relies on.  However, I still can't help but
believe that there is more than a coincidence in this correlation, as
anterior
enteritis is a relatively rare form of colic, and virtually every case I
have
seen, save one, has been in an endurance horse on Strongid C.  I have
compared
notes with several other ride veterinarians, and they have noted this
problem,
too.  And Nicco, I agree that your horse's anemia was likely related to the
hypothyroidism rather than Strongid C, but don't forget that the many others
I
have seen were NOT hypothyroid, nor did we identify ANY other medical
problem.
None were anemic prior to the best of our knowledge, and all cleared up upon
removal of the Strongid C from their diets.  Again, I have NOT seen anemias
in
non-endurance horses on this product, and I know a lot of breeders that use
it
in their youngsters and sometimes in their broodmares.

Regarding the comment that the company would not knowingly market a product
that was harmful, I agree, but remember that the product was never tested in
endurance horses, nor indeed are most products.

Heidi Smith, DVM


-----Original Message-----
From: Tracy Sahagun <tlsahagun@yahoo.com>
To: ridecamp@endurance.net <ridecamp@endurance.net>
Date: Monday, January 04, 1999 8:20 PM
Subject: Strongid C


>I know this subject probably has been discussed many times in the
>past; however, I was not able to find it in archives.  I understand
>that some of you may have had bad experiences with endurance horses on
>the Strond C program.  What have been some of your experiences?