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This thread reminds me of the fact that our son-in-law was doing very well 
on Tevis several years ago, and when he got to Francisco's there was a pile 
of alfalfa hay which his horse lit into.  In a short while, the horse was 
choking, and since the choke could not be resolved without treatment, the 
horse was DQ'd from the ride.  Treatment resolved the choke, but it was 
already too late to salvage the ride.  Too bad.....

Barbara

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "David LeBlanc" <dleblanc@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <suendavid@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>; <ridecamp@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Friday, April 29, 2005 11:20 AM
Subject: RE: [RC] DO NOT FEED BEET PULP DRY - Part 1


> Erica DeVoti said:
>
> > This is a post for anyone deciding to feed beet pulp.  I know the
> directions and many advocates >say you can feed dry....BUT DO NOT FEED
> DRY!!!!  SOAK!!!!
>
> Susan said:
> > Based on *peer-reviewed data* (as opposed to "testimonials" which I 
> > venture
> to guess verge on the shall we say, highly emotional and not particularly
> objective), the most common source of obstruction is hay, followed by
> pellets of any composition, followed by grain, followed by everything 
> else,
> including beet pulp.
> ---------------------------
>
> On the way to more degrees than I really needed, I was subject to quite a
> bit of statistics and experimental design training. While I have 
> tremendous
> respect for scientific method and your expertise in equine nutrition (not 
> to
> mention your writing ability), I would have to disagree with you on this
> one.
>
> While what inputs correlate well with some outcome make for excellent
> studies, and do help us make better decisions that work most of the time
> (good thing for vets - you see a lot of horses), I'm much less concerned
> about what causes choke in the average horse than what causes choke in my
> horses. Partially based on your advice, we did feed dry pelleted beet pulp
> to our horses, and it appears that we can safely do so for all but two of
> our horses. For the other two, it is a very repeatable experiment that
> feeding dry beet pulp (in one case, just not thoroughly soaked beet pulp
> will do) will cause choke often enough to be a hazard. Neither of these 
> two
> horses have choked from any other cause while under our care (several 
> years
> each).
>
> While I'm well aware that a sample size of 8 isn't anywhere close to large
> enough to draw broader conclusions from, and I'm not trying to predict 
> what
> could happen in the larger population, but from repeatable experience with
> 25% of my equine population, I find that soaking it is safer. A sample 
> size
> of 8, while not meeting the 95% confidence level you'd like to see, could
> still be significant - you just have large error bars.
>
> Given my experience, observations, and scientific training, I would tend 
> to
> question these studies you cite. Perhaps the research methodology is 
> flawed.
> It wouldn't be the first time that peer-reviewed data turned out to be
> flawed. All it takes to end up with the results you cite when there really
> is a correlation is a failure to identify some other contributory factor.
> You can easily overwhelm a signal by adding in enough noise. For example, 
> an
> interesting experiment would be to feed horses wet beet pulp for long 
> enough
> that they knew it was something yummy, then switch them abruptly to dry, 
> and
> see what happens. An obvious confounding factor would be that if the horse
> doesn't like beet pulp, then it wouldn't eat enough to choke.
>
> Like you, I don't like anecdotal "data", I don't like the lack of 
> scientific
> rigor in our sport and industry, but when it comes right down to it, I 
> don't
> care nearly as much about the average horse as I do my own.
>
> I frequently refer people to your web site as a source of information and
> find your advice in general to be excellent, but on this one specific
> matter, I don't agree.
>
>
>
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