Re: RC: Re: Complex Carbohydrate Use

[CMKSAGEHIL@aol.com]

In a message dated 12/16/99 1:16:08 AM Pacific Standard Time, Tivers writes:

<< Are you ready for a cite war? I am. Glycogen sparing under what 
circumstances? Not under elevarted glucose/insulin circumstances. >>

Nope--you've been provided the sources above countless times by others.  No 
need for me to repeat them.  They are in the archives.

<<Whoopps, lets not go crazy here. A tree is a complex carbohydrate. Why 
wouldn't we attemt to stoke up the furnace with a nice cedar chip meal? For 
the same reason we don't want to rely on cellulose--it's a terribly 
inefficient energy source.>>

Technically, you're right about the tree.  But there are other factors that 
influence the digestibility--lignin, etc.--so that's why one uses QUALITY 
roughage (ie that which is digestible) instead of feeding trees.  In the 
great scheme of things (going beyond energy and looking at the whole 
nutritional picture) hair and chicken feathers are made of protein, too, but 
we don't substitute them for quality protein in a ration any more than we 
substitute wood chips for good hay.  Get real here.

<<And they're NOT the same as glucose/glycogen. Again, how many pounds of hay 
will deliver VFAs in such abundance that they will overcome the benefits of 
elevated blood glucose? Not ten tons.>>

No one is trying to "overcome" blood glucose!  You miss the point entirely, 
which is that a constant level of VFA's helps to SUPPORT blood glucose levels 
and to spare glycogen, so that they will go farther and last longer.  If the 
VFA's are gone, you likely couldn't get the glucose in fast enough without an 
IV drip.

<<Who says? IV glucose will keep the muscle and vital functions going even if 
the gut is entirely cut off from the blood stream. Not so the other way 
around.>>

Never said it would.  But see the above statement.  You'd about have to run 
an IV line to get the glucose in fast enough and in a sufficiently steady 
state.  It's the VFA's that keep you from having to do that--so the blood 
glucose lasts longer and goes farther.

<<You keep coming back to that statement, but your argument goes far beyond 
it. Again, all we're talking about here is carbohydrate supplementation 
during a ride as an ergogenic aid. It works. It's real. It's no big deal. The 
sky is not falling.  >>

Ah, so now you finally admit that this is supplementation, rather than an 
attempt to replace the entire diet of the horse.  Good!  We're making some 
progress here.  No one ever said that your supplementation wouldn't work, or 
claimed that the sky was falling.  Just wanted you to admit that it IS more 
accurately described as supplementation instead of some new whiz-bang 
reinvention of nutrition.  Thanks!  You've finally done so.

Heidi


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