ridecamp@endurance.net: [endurance] color, for the last time (I hope)

[endurance] color, for the last time (I hope)

Gwen Dluehosh (dluehosh@vt.edu)
Fri, 5 Apr 1996 12:46:33 -0500

Ok, here's another thing you color people should know. Black is the base
color for bay- ie, bay (Bag) is a dilution of BLACK (B). HOwever, BAY
happens to be dominant over black.
In Arabs only though, there seems to be a paradox- you can get a bay from a
black and chestnut mating- the parents are presumed to be BB and bb, right?
So, how is this occurring?? Well:::

THERE ARE TWO GENES CONTROLLING BLACK IN THE ARAB!
One is the regular B gene and then there is another which I will call "K".
K is dominant no matter what it gets crossed with , except gray, but we
will ignore that for now. So the black horse above is obviously a BagB, or
BagBag (bay/black gene or bay/bay gene PLUS K- but not KK (would thorw
black 100%)

so we have a horse that is KkBag- where the dash is anything else. So the
baby may get a bay gene but no K gene, and of course since the dam is
chestnut, that is always recessive, so the baby is bay. Take a look at some
of Hallany Mistanny's babies/crosses to see what I am talking about.

Now, just to add to the confusion, there is a nonK black, where the
stallion is still black. His genotype is BB. or Bb only. He cannot have
any Bag (bay dilution) or he would be a bay horse!
SO, when he is crossed with a chestnut, 50% are black, and 50% are chestnut
(Bb sire) OR 100% are black (BB sire)

I hope this makes sense to most of you. If not, write back privately and i
will explain better.

Gray is also a separate gene, denoted by G. As explained in the other post,
you can have a GG horse, which will ONLY THROW GRAY, no matter WHAT it is
bred to, or you can have Gg, which will throw color 50% of the time. The
interesting thing is that if you can see what color the foal is, you'll
know what the genes are to an extent- i had a gray colt who is liver
chestnut at the moment, so I know both parents have at least one chestnut
gene. (One parent was gray)
I also know that the mother was bay, but NOW I know she has NO K gene
(she'd have been black) and she is heterozygous- she carries a Bag and a b
gene- she can thorw only bay or chestnut. I also know that the father had a
bay gene cause he was bay as a colt, so I know that he also is heterozygous
Bagb and has a gray masking gene.

Which is really cool, because we bred the same stallion to a GRAY mare who
had had several colored babies (I think chestnut AND Bay) and we got a BAY
filly, yes she will stay that color. Now, I don't know if this fily will
have any chestnut gene cause the mother and father were both Bagb horses
with a gray masking gene-G, but I do know that neither of the gray horses
is homozygous GG. So, while I may not be looking at color per se, I like to
imagine what I can get- with gray you can just about have anything hidden
in there.

Here's a question for those of you that have stuck with it: What do you get
if you cross a KkBBag with a chestnut(bb)? And what color i sthe sire ?
Wat are possible colors of babies, and what if bot horses are also
heterozygous grays (Gg)? What is the only color you WON"T get?

KkBBagGg x bbkkGg = ?
(Theme from Jeopardy)
Good luck
Gwen

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